Tattva-viveka
Faith Crisis
Nitai Joseph - March 23, 2007 4:08 pm
Since I began actively pursuing KC, there have been 2 people who have fostered my faith most significantly. Swami, and Bhakti Sudhir Goswami Maharaja currently of SCSmath. Recently I came in contact with some followers of Narayan Maharaj, and after being practically force fed the "pure-devotee" concept it got me wondering about him. I saw his website had over a thousand lectures and i thought, " if this isn't dangerous for me I would love to utilize this resource. So I started asking around what people's thoughts were about NM and so on. Then I wrote my brother who has taken initiation from Govinda Maharaja, and has personal association of BSGM sometimes. As I was writing I remembered reading this article a few months back "Going beyond Narayan" and I wondered if that was about Narayan Maharaja. 
So I asked my brother and of course as you all know, it's confirmative. So I went back to read it and I was shocked at the intensity, and thought, "Is this offensive?, sahajya is a big word". After speaking to a few people I came to think that he was not overdoing it, partially because it was in reply to some letter, of which I don't know the contents, but I speculate either diminishing Srila Sridhar Maharaja or justifying excessive rasa-katha with his name. Then just last night I had quite an intense discussion with a former follower of NM that rooted my faith in the accuracy of the article even more. BUT, now just today I found the thread on Tattva Viveka discussing this very same article, and it's author.
So my question is, how is one to approach this situation, where the two people who are helping hold up your weak faith have some discrepancy? I know details can be different from guide to guide, but this seems more like a character assessment then a detail. 
I guess the issue is with my idealism of wanting those who inspire me to be flawless, so how to deal with reality?? How can a situation like this not effect my faith in the other teachings I have recieved from someone, or should it? 
Nanda-tanuja Dasa - March 23, 2007 7:24 pm
I think it’s important to have single guide when you are in the beginning stages, Guru Maharaja gave an example of a fence around young bhakti creeper, but then when tree is large and strong it will push through the fence, meaning when your faith and standing is strong enough you can listen to many guides and harmonize different opinions without having a faith crisis. It seems that you have many well wishers around you to help you with your progress, but eventually you would have to make a choice and come under the shelter of the Vaishnava who inspires you the most.
Madangopal - March 23, 2007 7:29 pm
My best advice in this kind of situation is to take your doubt to the persons involved and see how they deal with your question. In my experience, Swami does not avoid anything controversial or difficult to talk about. Take your question to him and see if his answer satisfies you, boosts your faith or creates more doubt. If you wish, do the same with the other Maharaj. Though this is a forum specific to followers and friends of Swami's, it may be a little too public to address your specific concerns and he may want to clarify more for you.
Vamsidhari Dasa - March 24, 2007 1:34 am
I have to echo what my dear godbrothers have said so far in emphasizing that tended feith should be fostered under the shelter of your Guru deva who will dispell your doubts and find the proper way of explaining things to you so that you can understand them. We are all limited in our ability to understand and internalize what the Guru is telling us. That is why in His infinite mercy he keeps reapeating and repeating things to us. One day it just clicks. 
So, position yourself in such a way that you can hear and forster what you have inside. 
If something or someone is repelling you more then attracting you then that thing or person is probably not for you. It is not a good fit.
With the Guru it is a perfect fit because we have always been in a relationship with our real Guru. 
Sometimes out of our eagerness to find "a bonified spiritual master without whom there is no progress in KC" we run to the first shining light we see like moths to a flame.
Our lives call us to constantly tollerate conflicts and live with paradoxes. 
As we grow our capacity to understand things changes and so does the world around us, even though, the locus of channge is internal. Maybe we cannot understand who is a pure devotee and who is not. But why is that important? Why does that challenge faith?
Wanting the guide to be flawless is such a young thing. And I dont mean this pejoratively. In some ways it is undestandable, it is developmentally appropriate. But I have a bias as to where that feeling comes from. It does not flow from another's flaw but from a very tender wish that someone outside of us who is perfect and flawless compensates for our imperfections and flaws. Its like saying if I have perfect Guru I must be perfect too. So the reality is that the world and oters are not perfect and even though the Guru is perfect in his knowledge of the srciptires, and in his devotional life in other ways he or she might not be perfect. Just think that our Guru loves us despite our flaws, actually he does not see them as obstacles in our progress but as opportunities to serve. In love there are not flaws just ornaments. 
The more challenging task for us is how to love our Guru back despite of our flaws.
Hopefully, this will provide some food for thought. 
Swami - March 24, 2007 2:33 am
Ah, dilemma. This has come to help you. Krsna is so kind to you. I thought he would wait for some time before he brought this up to you, but apparently he feels that you need to grow now. You should feel blessed.
Nitai Joseph - March 24, 2007 11:10 am
Sometimes out of our eagerness to find "a bonified spiritual master without whom there is no progress in KC" we run to the first shining light we see like moths to a flame. :Big Grin:
To the best my self-reflection I dont think I'm in a rush to take initiation, I am eager to be able to seriously consider such a commitment. When I find myself thinking "Oh, maybe such and such is my guru" I chase that mentality away.
Wanting the guide to be flawless is such a young thing. And I dont mean this pejoratively. In some ways it is undestandable, it is developmentally appropriate. But I have a bias as to where that feeling comes from. It does not flow from another's flaw but from a very tender wish that someone outside of us who is perfect and flawless compensates for our imperfections and flaws. Its like saying if I have perfect Guru I must be perfect too.
I totally agree. and after looking up pejoratively I don't take it like that. It's the mentality that I can give my bhakti creeper to someone else and they will do the work, therefore if I find the best gardener, I can sleep easy. So theoretically I guess I can recognize this mentality, but rooting it out is not so easy.
Maybe we cannot understand who is a pure devotee and who is not. But why is that important? Why does that challenge faith?
I guess it challenges my faith because I am skeptical of whether I am sincere or looking for "the real thing", therefore worried wether or not Paramatma is bringing me into the association of those who are after the real thing. So I guess if I can assign "pure devotee" to someone then I don't have to think I might be being misled due to my tendency to want to be misled. Does that make sense on some level? My skepticism about my own motives makes me question those around me since it's my motives that bring me into that circle. I feel like how could I even have the sincerity to come in the proximity of bona-fide seeker or guru. And that keeps me from really committing to that camp, therefore I don't have someone yet who is the final word for me, which I guess make me the final word, and that can only spell disaster.
and even though the Guru is perfect in his knowledge of the srciptires, and in his devotional life in other ways he or she might not be perfect.
Could you possibly elaborate on this. If those two things are perfect then what could be imperfect?
Swami, your comment is oddly comforting, in a healthy discomfort kind of way. Maybe you could elaborate if you have time, or we could contact on e-mail?
Thank you all for responses it's been really helpful for me to have to enunciate my problems, it helps me to know more what my issues really are.
Syamasundara - March 24, 2007 12:19 pm
I second Vamsidhari and your own words actually. Guru Tattva includes caitya guru, the guru within. Ultimately your guru is Krsna (acaryam mam vijaniyat), and the soul is a unit of desire, so all you can really do is sort through your desires, pick the most sincere and transcendental one, and observe it. Magnetize yourself with this meditation, and at some point the fatal attraction between you and the right guide for you will happen. Don't reduce Sri Guru to the mere object of a choice you make. Rather, make yourself the worthy object of the attention and affection of any nice Vaisnava who can guide you, and pray a lot.
I joined my Guru maharaja's mission after four years of Sunday feasting in Iskcon, and I had gotten to know a few things, and see a few attitudes, so I was very cautious when I arrived at Eugene. I remember a dream in which GM had meet in the freezer :Big Grin: but my suspicion/suspention didn't last two weeks, because I knew I had prayed to Nityananda Prabhu so intensely and sincerely, and I felt like a tuning fork vibrating in my heart strongly during GM's classes. So that's what I wish for you. As a unit of desire, your desires and sincerity are your only jurisdiction, so work on those, and Krsna will do the rest 
Swami - March 24, 2007 1:29 pm
Swami, your comment is oddly comforting, in a healthy discomfort kind of way. Maybe you could elaborate if you have time, or we could contact on e-mail?
Fine. You can email me at swami@swami.org or visit with me here at Audarya.